Wayne Zell: Episode 1170

Transcript

[0:00:38] HA: My next guest has created a super meaningful and easy-to-follow guide, which is designed to help entrepreneurs build a strong foundation for exiting their businesses on their terms. Welcome to the Author Hour Podcast. I’m your host Hussein Al-Baiaty and I’m joined by author Wayne Zell, who is here to talk about his new book, Your Multimillion-Dollar Exit: The Entrepreneur’s Business Succession Planner, A Blueprint for Wealth Guide to Success. Let’s get into it. Hello friends and welcome back to Author Hour. I’m very excited today because I have a special guest, Mr. Wayne Zell. Welcome to the show, my friend.

[0:01:18] Wayne Zell: Hussein, it’s great to be with you, and thanks for having me on the show today.

[0:01:22] HA: Yeah, absolutely. So Wayne, you know, I know you just launched a book and I’m very excited for you and I’m excited to share with our audience all about your journey, how you got on this path of wealth management and not just wealth management but really just identifying this blueprint for how people exit a business or a succession plan and I just appreciate that because I once had a business that — I had over 16 employees and it got so big I didn’t know what to do and I told you earlier that your book is one of those ones that I wish I kind of had earlier. So I’m excited that it’s out in the world now but before we get into the book, I love to give our audience and listeners a little bit of a personal background of who you are, maybe where you grew up, and what led you down to the path that you're on now.

[0:02:11] Wayne Zell: It’s an interesting story. First of all, I’m from DC, Washington DC and I live in Northern Virginia but how I got to where I am today, it’s funny, I was thinking about that this morning. When I was a freshman in college, it was after my first year at the University of Virginia, I was driving home with my dad and he said, “Well, how did it go this semester?” I said, “It was great. I had a great year, grades were good.” I was co-lead in Godspell, you know, I’m a right-brain guy, I was really into music, I was writing music, and it was becoming prolific. It was flowing out of me as a lot of people say and it’s just great. So I was totally focused and I said, “It was great” and he said, “So what are you going to major in?” and I said, “You know, I’m thinking double major, music, drama, so that I can go into musical theater maybe on Broadway.” Because I’ve gotten a lot of really good feedback from a lot of people over the years and I’ve never just taken that jump and there was this pregnant pause. Silence and my dad goes, “So how are you going to pay for school?” and I’m going, “Oh, what? What do you mean by that?” You know, “What do you mean, how am I going to pay for school? You’re going to pay for school” He said, “No” he said, “You need to get trained in a profession in some kind of you know, useful background so that when you graduate, you can support yourself and I don’t have to worry about supporting you” and that’s the key, another pregnant pause ensued and I’m sitting there, thinking about you know, “Wait a minute, he just dashed all of my dreams and I’m supposed to respond to this?” It was good advice because I said, “But what should I major in, Dad?” He said, “You need to go to the business school. The McIntire School of Commerce at the University of Virginia is one of the best schools in the country.” That was 40 some years ago, you know? Almost 45 years ago. I said, “Okay, like what will I study?” He said, “You should study accounting because it’s the language of business” and you know begrudgingly, I applied to the school. I got in, it was a struggle at first because I really didn’t know what I was doing, and as a right-brain person, a creative person who did creative writing and getting into accounting and numbers and stuff like that, I wasn’t bad at it but I had to immerse myself in the stuff and I taught myself how to be a left-brain thinker. Analytical. Really digging into details as opposed to always thinking visionary, creative, and doing cool stuff and it was a big adjustment for me but I excelled at it and I succeeded. I got a job at an accounting firm and I worked in the big accounting firm, Arthur Anderson & Company, which is one of the big eight back then and I went into the tax department, which was hard to get into right out of undergraduate and I did that for two years and while I was there, I was realizing that I was surrounded by all these lawyers who had a background in accounting and law and they were so smart and they were so capable and so technically proficient and I felt like you know, in order for me to succeed as a professional, I’m going to need to go to law school so that I can learn what they learned to think like a lawyer and even further my analytical left side of my brain. So I went to law school. Again, it was a struggle, I got out, I excelled, I did really well in tax law and so I started out as a tax lawyer doing transactional work and then I – because I loved working with people one-on-one, I gravitated into both estate planning and business planning and for the last 37 plus years, that’s what I focused on and so it marries two very different areas of law together because of my background and accounting in tax, I’m able to work with entrepreneurs and businesses of various sizes. I represented some really big family companies, the name’s really well-known, I won’t say them to protect the innocent but some very big companies, family-owned businesses, and then entrepreneurs who are just starting up their businesses and over the last 37 years, I’ve worked in business. I actually left practicing law and worked for a George Saurus-backed company called News Reel, which was a spinoff of one of the first search engine companies called Info Seek. I did that for a couple of years. I was the CFO, the chief financial officer, and the general counsel of that company and I worked inside the company building their business model and working with all the employees. I did it once again back in the late 2010s when I worked for a company that was a registered investment advisory firm and I was general counsel, chief compliance officer and I was in the executive team and I did that as an experiment. I wanted to really immerse myself in different industries and different businesses and because of that, I have the skill set that is really unique for lawyers, accountants, and others that I can really see the whole picture of what it’s like to do business succession planning for entrepreneurs. I just loved what I do and love to take it out to them and help them succeed, help them realize their personal dreams of wealth and freedom. So that’s my story in a nutshell.

[0:07:32] HA: You know man, it’s a very powerful story but I know there’s quite a bit that happened sort of in between because there are so many transformations I feel like for you and where you got to — just how you brought this whole book together is actually pretty cool. But I want to go back in time a little bit and if you don’t mind, I mean, what you shared with me before we got on the recording that you had gotten cancer at one point in your life and that really woke you up to a specific realization. Can you go there a little bit and share about that sort of story?

[0:08:03] Wayne Zell: Absolutely. I talk about it a lot when I’m giving speeches and I’m talking to clients and friends. I mean, it was back in 2002, and I wasn’t feeling real good, I went to see my internist and he said, “Look, you know, I think you had to go see this doctor and get tested” and so I went and got tested and it turned out, I had prostate cancer at the age of 43, which is really young. And so, this is you know, a long time ago. I’ll be 65 this year, so I’ve survived it but when you hear that and my wife was at home with my four young children and she had stopped working to basically take care of the family, there’s a bit of a stressor, you know? So you know, I’d find out that I’ve got cancer, I ultimately had surgery at Johns Hopkins and everything was successful but you know, it leaves a mark on you and after you have the surgery, you have a period of time — It took me about a month to recuperate and at the time, I was working for a big law firm, a firm out of Boston, which had 500 lawyers, 500 plus lawyers and I was a partner there and I was doing very well but, when you have the time to reflect and realize what you have in your life, much like what you had to reflect on, we talked before you were in a refugee camp. I can’t even imagine what that’s like. I was suffering from the angst of having had cancer, four young kids, and then, you start to realize, I came out of it okay but what’s the rest of my life going to look like? How will I react to this? And I really started digging deep inside and, “Is it all about billing hours as a lawyer?” and the answer was no. “Why do I do what I do?” Well, I do what I do. To this day, it’s the stuff that gets me up, it’s the juice that gets me going in the morning, it makes me grateful for what I have is that I’m here to help people. I’m here to help my friends, my clients, my family, my employees realize their dreams of wealth and freedom. It’s my tagline, it’s what gets me going, it’s what got me going. I mean, I left that firm ultimately with some coaching in 2004, I opened up my law firm, and then I sold it to another law firm in 2011 and I decided I needed to get back into this because I loved doing what I do and I love doing it the way I do it and you know, it’s just – it’s my passion and so, going through a life-changing event like that always has some kind of impact on you and on me, it was like, “What am I going to do the rest of my life?” “Well, I’m going to help people” I’m going to help people realize their dreams and this is the way I can do it best.

[0:10:34] HA: It’s realizing that not just that you want to help people specifically but you also have a set of skills and a set of ways of doing, going about doing that, that really offers not only value but just like this – it feels like this commitment. This authentic commitment to really, you know, wanting to live something out for yourself but in extension, the outcome of that is it helps someone else and I think for me, I love that. I mean, in that state of creativity, whether we’re writing books, right? We talked about that or for me like, I love painting and art and just this, right here, this moment where I get to speak to someone about their life, about their work, about their commitments. We’re sharing deep things and let’s be honest, a couple of hours ago we were strangers, right? But the reality is, we are so interconnected in this idea that our beliefs in what we care to do, it feels kind of selfish like, “Oh, I want to put my time, energy, and resources into this” but the reality is, it is actually very unselfish because that thing, once it’s done or how it’s done or the way that it’s done benefits others. And it’s like, I feel like for me, that’s always been a battle just with myself in convincing myself that what I’m doing is valuable and worth it, and as creatives, we run into those blocks of like, “Does this even fucking matter?” and it does. It does, right? On a bigger scale, it does for yourself.

[0:12:03] Wayne Zell: It matters, you know why? You know why? Because you’re able to give yourself back to others. You give up your soul and then you give up your heart and your mind and the talents that you’ve got, use them to the best of your ability to help others and so to me, it’s the juice that gets me up in the morning and keeps me going throughout the day and probably makes me look a lot younger than I actually am so.

[0:12:26] HA: I’m sure it does man, it brings you – makes you very vibrant, of course, but with that, you know, I want to get into the book a little bit because that also resonated with me, and that, owning a business for over a decade and then basically deciding of like a career change. I shift back into more of my own creativity. I had to sell the business, I had to figure out how to do that, I had to – There were so many, it was about a year and a half worth of like really, almost weekly, trying to piece things together to prepare it to sell and that was a journey. I had a lot of help, you know? And a lot of people that I love really help me with that and so, this is your work. This is your line of work and I appreciate that because it’s so important because it addresses such a huge pain point. But let’s first, can you share a little bit of a personal experience where you, having an exit strategy in place, saved you from unexpected losses?

[0:13:19] Wayne Zell: I don’t know, I don’t have that situation come up yet. I can tell you that I have –

[0:13:23] HA: You’re a good strategist, that’s why.

[0:13:26] Wayne Zell: Well, you know I’ve done it enough for so many people. I mean, hundreds of people over their careers that I now have my own business succession plan and you know, because I get asked that, you know? I’m not getting any younger, I’m in my 60s. People ask, “You know, what’s your business succession plan? What if you’re not around?” My answer is, I’m building and I’ve built my business succession plan, I’ve got somebody 20 years younger than me taking over part of the practice. I’m recruiting another person to come in and take over the other half of the practice, so that not only can do more of the business succession planning holistically but I can also do speaking and I can also go out and you know, mentor younger people, which I love doing and teach, which I do. I currently teach at George Mason University. So my exit is planned and it may not go exactly as I’ve planned it and that’s what I teach to the entrepreneurs that I work with — you don’t know what’s going to happen in the future, you never know what’s going to happen. In the intro of my book, I talk about a government contractor who died suddenly and his son who was friends with my daughter gave me a call and so right around Christmas. And he called me, he said, “My dad passed away” and I said, “What happened?” He said, “He was a diabetic and he went into diabetic shock and he fell and hit himself and he died from the fall.” I said, “Oh my God, so sorry to hear that.” He was frantic, he said, “I don’t know what to do, I work at the business that he founded and I don’t know what to do. My mother doesn’t know anything about the business and what do I do?” And I just said, “You know what? We got this, I’ve got this. Just give me some time, let’s talk about it and just spend some time thinking about your dad, making sure that your family’s okay, and then we’ll figure out what to do with the business.” So we did and it turned out, the guy had actually taken in some outside investment from two of his friends who were really well-known in the business and well-respected and fortunately, those people wanted to help as well. So we put together a board. I was on the board, these two investors were on the board and the mother and the son were on the board. We put together a board of directors and we created an exit plan where none existed before and fortunately, with those two investors and me involved, we were able to come up with a path to the success of the ultimate — everybody was telling us, “You’re not going to be able to sell this business.” The guy was a service-disabled veteran, he was subject to small business set-aside rules and everybody said, “You know, the business might be worth 10, 11 million dollars max. You’re not going to sell it for any more than that” which is a lot of money but we brought in an investment banker. The guy was able to realize the value here. We brought in outside managers to run the business where the founder, you know, wasn’t – hadn’t built his succession plan and these guys and the board helped navigate over the next two years, the company, to triple its size and revenue and we sold the business for close to 30 million dollars and the family was ecstatic and to this day, the son who called me on that day, he hasn’t forgotten and he keeps turning back to me. It’s one of the greatest feelings to get when you can help somebody like that but you never know what’s going to happen and the lesson is, plans change, situations change, the economy changes, COVID hits, you know, you just don’t know what’s going to happen. So you have to have a plan that’s dynamic, that can morph over time, it’s not set in stone and you have to work with people who are there to help you. As an entrepreneur, most people don’t want to think about that kind of stuff, you know? They don’t want to think about it, they’d rather work in the business than on the business and what my job is to do is to help them work on the business and I can help them do that without them having to take too much time doing that.

[0:17:20] HA: Yeah, it’s so powerful, man, and I can’t imagine how grateful I would be had I reached out when I was struggling because I feel like you’re a person that was like, “Let me look at all my resources and how we can solve this and come to this in a way that is really helpful.” To where I feel like if I reached out to just a lawyer, right? Or just a person who helps with exit strategies but has a check in mind, right? A couple of boxes to check off and it’s like you need – and I did reach out to a few people. It’s like, “Oh, you got to get these documents in order” and it was very like, “Here’s kind of how you do it” but there is no meat to how you do it and it’s like, “Man, this is my baby, this is my business. I’ve grown it” I can’t imagine what your friend was going through having, of course, lost his father, and now this huge sort of business to deal with and all of those things. So just being there as a human being and saying, “Hey man, we’ll figure this out. Give me a couple of days” or whatever it is. It is just that feeling of reassurance that someone else can come in and help me out that is so powerful and obviously ties into what you have committed your life to. What are some common misconceptions that entrepreneurs have about what buyers and investors want and what they fear?

[0:18:38] Wayne Zell: Common misconceptions, let me think about that for a second. I think the biggest misconception that entrepreneurs have is what the value of their business really is. They may think it’s worth a lot more than what it is worth today and so part of the process of doing succession planning is finding out what the business is worth and getting outside input into that. You know, it requires some technical analysis and discounted cash flow analysis. Comparable company analysis, what are other companies selling for in your space, in your industry with the same kind of customers in your size, and really, it varies from company to company. So I think the biggest misconception is they may think it’s worth more than it’s worth and that gap in value needs to be addressed. How do we get it to the point where the entrepreneur can get what they want out of the business, what they think it’s worth or what they hope it’s worth and how do we get to that point? So it’s realizing what the value gaps are and then figuring out how to fill it, how to fill those gaps. Bringing in experts, sometimes it might be a human resources person that comes in to help with employee planning and engagement, and retention. It might be an evaluation person that comes in to help really analyze what the business is worth today and what it could be worth if it hits certain targets and achieves certain things, how to maintain a culture. But the other thing about the misconception is, is that the entrepreneur doesn’t need to worry about it, you know? They typically are so immersed in their business, they love their business, they love working in their business, whether they’re engineers or financial people or sales and marketing people, they love to immerse themselves in the business and they surround themselves with other like-minded people and they forget about the fact that they need to work on the business. They need to take time away to really look at the big picture and part of the big picture is focusing on their personal goals. What do they want to do when they’re not working and how do they take care of their family using the business as a vehicle to fund those goals and objectives? Do they want to achieve family harmony? Do they want to leave a legacy? Do they want to maintain a specific culture or build a culture for employees that are going to last beyond them or the business after they sell it or after they exit it? Do they want to give something back in the form of community involvement or charitable giving? How do they minimize their taxes? How do they protect their assets from creditors and things when they go wrong? How can they mentor other people? All these things are goals that every entrepreneur is different and they tend to focus on themselves in the business and the business itself without stepping back and realizing, “Hey, I got to take care of my spouse. I got to take care of my kids, my grandkids. I got to take care of my partners. I got to take care of my employees. How do I do that?” and if I can’t do it in a way that takes all of this into consideration, that’s part of the business succession plan. It’s figuring out, “Do I have enough to live on for the rest of my life and if I don’t, if something happens to me tomorrow, if I die or become disabled, what is my plan? How am I going to keep this company going?” All of this is part of business succession planning and I have chunked it down in the book into different frameworks and different processes and I address it from the entrepreneur’s perspective who might someday sell their business. There’s a whole chapter about selling your business and the things that you need to be aware of, technically, so that you don’t make some of the same mistakes that others have made in the past.

[0:22:17] HA: There is so much to that, right? That journey could be as long as a couple of years and as short as a few months but I mean, the reality is the further you think about it, the better. I feel like as a young entrepreneur when I was starting my little t-shirt business and not knowing where it was going to go and all these things, I knew at some point down the line that there would be an opportunity to sell it, especially as my contract started to grow. I was like, “This is not something I definitely want to do for the rest of my life.”

[0:22:50] Wayne Zell: You said a couple of years or maybe some months. I mean, I’ll give you a story, a real quick story.

[0:22:54] HA: Yeah, please do.

[0:22:55] Wayne Zell: I work with a guy, he’s a very good friend of mine, became a good friend as we worked closer and closer together but it goes all the way back in 2000, 2001 when I started working with him and he had a company. They had like five people working for him and I was with him all the way up until 2019 at the end when he sold his company for USD 53 million and had 375 employees. Along the way, there were lots of you know, rough waters that we had to navigate. My job was to be there for him as his counselor, as his concierge, as his conciliary, you know, like Tom Hayden and The Godfather. My job was to be there for him as his lawyer but also as his business advisor and as his friend and so for 20, almost 20 years, 19 years, we worked together. He grew the company, but I didn’t, he gave me a lot of credit and he treated me very, very well in the end but he gave me a lot of credit but he was the guy. He was the mastermind behind this business and my job was just to help guide him along and give him the tools that he needed when it was appropriate and helped him get out of the business and fortunately he got out before COVID hit. He made a very good profit on it and now he’s able to pursue some of his other personal dreams that he really wanted to pursue. Before when he was really engaged, 100%, 110% in the business. He was able to get out and now, he’s able to spend more time with his family, spend more time doing some of his personal hobbies, and also, delve into technology, which was something that he had done in building his company. He is a technologist but now he gets to do some really cool things on the side and he’s enjoying all that and he’s mentoring young entrepreneurs as well. So you know, these are all, it’s the stories that are in the book. They’re throughout the book is ideas and action and at the end of each segment, there are lessons learned, which summarizes each point in the book but it’s the stories that make the book and it’s the stories and the examples that I try to use from all the experience I’ve been fortunate enough to gain and representing all these folks over the many years I’ve been doing this.

[0:25:08] HA: Man, it’s so powerful and I love that, in thinking about it as a young entrepreneur is like what I, looking back, right? Hindsight is 20/20, looking back having someone like yourself that was just well-rounded in things that I was not aware of as far as how a business can mature and what happens then and always kind of keeping that in the back of our minds and getting that constant mentorship. It was actually not until I got a business coach in 2018 that I started even putting things in order, right? Because someone on the outside needs to help you sort of like a magnet kind of pulling you toward what that future could look like.

[0:25:48] Wayne Zell: I agree. I’ve used business coaches. I think business coaches are very helpful if they know what they’re doing, it was the business coach that I used in 2004 when I ultimately decided to take the risk with you know, a wife and four kids and a mortgage and everything and just basically go out on my own and I grew it and was successful and I am doing it again and I want to make it even more successful and it’s exciting to grow a business and execute on a vision but having the coaching was really helpful.

[0:26:17] HA: Yeah, it’s so powerful and I think a big part of the coaching, I think for me at least, it was the accountability, which is what I just loved. Because obviously sometimes not all entrepreneurs are like this but some, you kind of find yourself in a silo. You kind of find yourself in your own think tank and it’s just so much nicer to have someone on the outside making sure there’s air coming in so that you can think about things a little bit differently, which is beautiful. What was your favorite part of pulling this book together? Because I know it’s a journey. I know it’s no easy feat, been there, done that but what did you learn from the journey?

[0:26:53] Wayne Zell: What a great question. I started writing this book 13 years ago when I was less experienced but still very experienced as an attorney and a CPA and I started outlining it and you know, I got too busy and I came back to it a couple years later, refined the outline but never pulled the trigger on it and my daughter got married in April of last year. That was a catalyst for me, I caught COVID at the wedding. After I came out of COVID it was like, “Okay, I’m going to do this book because I’ve been thinking about it and thinking about it and thinking about it and I’m going to do this book” and so the hard part was starting and then you know, I read a lot of guides to writing your book and what decided was, I was going to get on a schedule and I set a deadline for myself because fortunately, I had already outlined the book and I knew generally what I wanted to say in it. So I had to build the content within the outline and that was hard and so I ended up dictating the book into a software program that allowed me to sort of organized it and then fix it and edit it and so on and so forth but I set a deadline. I said, “August 12th of 2022 was my deadline” and I finished the first full draft of the book and really, it’s morphed over time by adding graphics and the last week was probably the most fun for me. Because I’d actually left work, went down to a beach house in North Carolina in Albemarle Sound and I put myself away and locked myself up for a full week where I finishing up the book and at the same time, you know, creating graphics and designs, working with a graphic designer but mostly it was my drawings that ended up in the book That was fun. Again, it’s my right brain coming out. I’m a musician, artistic by training, I love doing that kind of stuff and that was the most fun time and then it’s becoming fun again because we’re now ready to launch the book. We’re launching the book, and the effort that’s going into that launch is really cool. I’ve got internal employees working on it, I’ve got my partner, my wife working on it. I’ve got Scribe Media helping me out with it, in terms of the marketing and the publication. Now, I’m scheduling speeches, which again, I’m very excited to take to the next level where I am presenting the book, presenting the concepts of the book in a way that is interesting to people so that they’ll not only buy the book but use it and refer it to others because I think there is a lot of great stuff in there and a lot of detail that you know if you want to get into a deeper dive, you can do that. There are sections in the book, that are deep dives, and go into real technical stuff but I can’t wait to get out and start speaking about it on podcasts and on speeches and conventions and it’s now taking me back to the time when I was on stage. So I get to get back on stage and talk about something that I created, which I’m really, really excited about and proud of. It is involving processes and a system of planning that most people don’t do and that they need to do it. If they’re entrepreneurs, they need to start thinking about this stuff and so it’s all this depth of knowledge or this technical stuff that I’ve acquired over 37 plus years as an attorney, 42 years as an accountant, now I got to bring it and give it to them in pieces and workable segments that they can pick and choose what they want to work on or they can do the whole thing. I’m so energized by that right now.

[0:30:37] HA: Yeah man, no, I love that and I feel your energy. I mean, I just feel like again, it’s back to the idea of when we align with our truest nature, it feels fucking selfish. It feels like I’m just doing this for me but in reality and how it actually looks is that it’s you’re injecting that energy and that creative force for it to impact others and I mean, if we’re not here to help each other just kind of prosper and grow and with anything, just through hard times and good times, laugh, whatever, what else are we here to do? That’s really what it all comes down to and your work is a testament to that my friend. It’s been an absolute pleasure just getting to hang out with you today and getting to know you. I feel like we talked for like 10 minutes before we got on the – 15 minutes almost before we got on the show because you’re just such an easy to talk to type of person and have an amazing personality, so I am glad we brought that out because your book is a testament and is an extension of who you are, which I just really appreciate. You’re right, the stories are so easy to navigate, and they are so well-written. So great job just taking at least that week off but I know it’s taking, you know, those things that take this much time, you know, 13-plus years. We talked about this too that books are born in those times of realization and it just takes a little while to build up the right momentum, and the right courage. The ingredients just need to come together but when they do, they feel how you feel. You know, just really excited to put it all together because they do take a long time, so congratulations.

[0:32:07] Wayne Zell: Yeah, it’s just the beginning though. I mean, the way I look at it is it’s I finally was able to do this and now there’s other things that are related to what are in this book that will come from it and it will give me an opportunity to expand on those other items. It’s just the beginning and so I feel like a kid. I feel like I’m in my 30s again, so it’s great.

[0:32:27] HA: That’s so great, man, I love that. So the book is called, Your Multimillion-Dollar Exit: The Entrepreneur’s Business Succession Exit Planner, A Blueprint for Wealth Guide to Success. It’s so powerful and so to the point but besides checking out the book on Amazon and Barnes & Nobles, all that good stuff online, where can people find you and connect with you, Wayne?

[0:32:49] Wayne Zell: Thanks, you can find me at waynezell.com. That’s where the author’s page is and there’s a landing page and more resources relating to the book there. You can connect and get an executive summary if you sign up in time and then you can also find me at Zell Law, zelllaw.com, which is our law firm’s website, which has my full biography there and tells you a little bit more about my background. But I just really again Hussein, I really appreciate the opportunity to talk to you today and to talk to the listeners and to talk about my book and my passion for business succession planning. Thanks a lot.

[0:33:27] HA: Yeah man, absolutely. It was an absolute pleasure, an honor to have you today my friend. Thanks again, Wayne. Congratulations on your book launch as well, buddy.

[0:33:35] Wayne Zell: Thank you.

[0:33:37] HA: Thank you all so much for joining us for this episode of Author Hour. You can find the book, Your Multimillion-Dollar Exit: The Entrepreneur’s Business Succession Exit Planner, A Blueprint for Wealth Guide to Success, right now on Amazon. For more Author Hour episodes, subscribe to this podcast on your favorite subscription service. Thanks for joining us, we’ll see you next time. Same place, different author.