Bradly Gotto: Episode 982

Transcript

[0:00:40] BB: Today on Author Hour, I’m speaking with Brad Gotto who just authored a new book, Spending Money and Having Fun. Here’s a brief description of the book: After years of hard work, long hours and countless sacrifices, you’re at the threshold of a monumental milestone, retirement, but are you ready? Sure, you’ve hired the right advisors and learned how to stockpile money, you’ve thought about taxes, healthcare, Medicare and social security but how will you make your paychecks last forever? What’s your plan to turn savings into income and how will you spend your days without those work commitments for the schedule that you once were given. You saved money for a lifetime, now, it’s time to spend it. In Spending Money and Having Fun, retirement income certified professional, Brad Gotto teaches you how to be smart about spending so you can stop worrying and live the life you want. Here's my conversation with Brad Gotto. Welcome into Author Hour. I’m your host Benji Block and thrilled to have Brad Gotto here with me. He has just authored a new book titled, Spending Money and Having Fun: Your Practical Guide to a Fearless Retirement. Brad, welcome to the show.

[0:01:52] Bradly Gotto: Thank you Benji, I appreciate it man.

[0:01:54] BB: Yeah, good to chat with you, congratulations on the book. Maybe before we get there, tell me like, what launched you into wealth management, what has made this the area for you to really sink your teeth into and something you really care about?

[0:02:07] Bradly Gotto: Loaded question. Here’s the very short story. I’ve been, I think, 16 years, Benji, in this industry in some form or fashion. That said, prior to that, I was a youth pastor so that’s kind of your natural progression to finance, right? But the things that scratch the itch for me in ministry were, I really loved education and educating people on things that I thought had meaning in life and can make a large impact in people’s lives, and my faith was one of those things and I wanted to make sure that kids, high school age kids, they kind of find the meaning in life that I found when I was in high school, and I wanted to share what I knew with other people and have a meaningful impact in their lives In this industry, as a financial advisor, I still get to scratch that itch. It’s just, I get to help people bring meaning to their money and make sure that their values and the things that they value in life are actually guiding their decisions, so that their values are guiding the money and not the other way around, and so never intended in doing this. It’s a very long story of how I tripped, fell, stumbled into it 16 years ago, but here I am, I guess.

[0:03:15] BB: Well, I got to say, we have some common background. I spent the last eight years or so in ministry as a creative arts pastor director and now I’m a full-time in podcasting and marketing, and there’s a lot of transferrable skills that you don’t realize in ministry that then end up working in other places. I love asking questions and I loved getting at people’s “why’s” and understanding what makes them tick, and that has really worked for me in podcasting. So, I actually, while it’s funny that you went youth pastor into wealth management, there’s some comedy there, it also does makes sense and I appreciate you giving us that background. It’s fun to hear how people have ended up where they ended up. So I think the next question would be, okay, you’ve spent some time in the industry, why now, Brad, as far as, “I’m going to take on writing a book” because that’s no small thing.

[0:04:05] Bradly Gotto: Yeah, you know, some people, it’s always been a life goal, I’ve always wanted to write a book, I thought about it for a very long time. None of that is true for me. I never thought I was going to be an author, I never really wanted to “write a book” or anything like that but the bottom line is, as our firm was growing and I was thinking about how I can help tell the story that we try to tell and help more people, it came up as an option, right? Somebody brought it to my attention like, “Hey, you should write a book” and I was like, “Uh, I don’t know” and I looked into it, looked into it and I found a good partner to help me in that process and so it took away some of the more daunting pieces of it for me anyway, and my personality and so really, what it evolved into was this opportunity, like I just said, to try to continue to educate and assist people in this phase of life that frankly, Benji, is kind of a new phenomenon. This idea of saving money into retirement accounts and then not working for a period of your life and quite frankly, a much longer period of life than it’s ever been. The baby boomer generation is blazing a trail in a lot of ways and are having to deal, as exciting as it is, this idea of being older and retiring and living on the pile of money that you saved. As fun as that sounds, it brings about a whole new set of challenges and a lot of them are emotional and behavioral. And my industry, Benji, fails in that area in a lot of ways. Guys and gals get so stuck on the numbers and chasing rate of return and my mutual fund can beat up your mutual fund, and it just see like all these people I was meeting as our firm was growing we’re so stuck on those things, and it was so hard to un-train that and get them to start living their values in a meaningful way and letting their money follow suit and, more importantly, driving this point home that you're not in the same phase of life anymore. It’s not just about growing your pile of money now, you got to figure out how to spend it, and part of that could be on your fund in lifestyle, part of that could be gifting through things like charities or to your kids or grandkids. Whatever it may be, it just dawned on me that a lot of people have no idea what they’re doing and it’s not a thing that my industry, wealth management, tends to focus on, and so the book was born.

[0:06:24] BB: So clearly, you’re talking to those that are in that phase. I wonder like who is the ideal person to pick it up like, who do you most think would benefit from reading this?

[0:06:35] Bradly Gotto: From an age perspective, it’s definitely that 50 plus crowd. Unless of course you're one of those lucky ones that’s going to get to retire in your 30s or 40s or something like that, and I do think that some of the behavioral stuff that’s talked about in the book kind of hits anybody at any age. The book is really actually geared for that 50 plus crowd that’s nearing that phase of life, that distribution, retirement phase of life and on up. I mean, it doesn’t matter if you’re 75 and you’ve been retired for 15 years already, it’s still a good book to pick up and it’s really, again, trying to guide some very practical things. So that it does have a chapter on social security, it does have a chapter on taxes and these different things that retirees deal with, but there’s a lot of attention paid to, like I said before, the behavioral side and the psychology side of what people deal with financial.

[0:07:19] BB: Yeah, let’s dig into some of the concepts of the book and we’ll go a little bit high level, right? Because people are going to actually go read this, but I loved the image you give in the intro of climbing a mountain and the whole way up, you’re thinking like this is the hard part but then, actually, coming down, you assume is easy but there’s actually great risk there, and I don’t know if it’s because I actually identify, like I’m someone that loves the outdoors. I’ve climbed a couple of mountains and I have experienced some of this. Explain that, what are those big misconceptions that people run into about retirement, thinking that that’s like the easy part?

[0:07:53] Bradly Gotto: Well, and don’t get me wrong, saving money isn’t easy, at least it isn’t for me. I don’t know about you Benji, I’m not by, some people I think are just kind of innate, they’re savers, that’s just who they are, it’s built into the fabric of the way they go about life. I’m not one of those people. Saving has always been a chore for me and so I don’t want to take anything away from the savings years and what it means to climb that mountain and get to the top, so that you can descend gracefully. There’s a lot to be said for that but the challenges are just different. Everything about it is different, you go from being a saver to a spender and one of the hardest parts of it, Benji, is if you think about it, as is the case with anything in life, you’ve built a habit. The habit is, I work and off the money that I earned, part of that is for my fund in lifestyle and my bills and things of that nature but part of it, I save so that at some point, I don’t have to work anymore and so you build that into your fabric for decades and then when you retire, that paycheck that was coming in the door every month, goes away, which is really scary for a lot of people. They don’t think it’s going to be—some people really think through that. A lot of people, it’s more of a reaction than it is a proactive thought to the fear that goes along with the fact that you don’t have a paycheck coming in the door anymore, and you have this pile of money that you’ve saved and maybe a social security check to go along with it, or pension to go along with it but ultimately, it’s a daunting thought. I think the best example I can give you is, I mean Benji, imagine being 22 years old, you're out of school, your first job and you walk in and you’re in orientation day one and they hand you your first paycheck, you’re like, “Wow, I get paid already?” They’re like, “Yeah, we just prepay upfront” and you open the check and you realize, they gave you your salary from now until the day you retire. It is up to you to take that pile of money and stretch it out over the next 40 years and what are the odds that you're going to have anything left even after 20 years, you know? Probably not very good but that is the task that retirees are facing, is you’ve got this pile of money that you’ve saved and you have to find an efficient way to turn that into a paycheck for the rest of your life, which is an unknown. I don’t know how long the rest of my life is going to be. So the set of muscles and the set of skills that you use to climb a mountain and be a saver versus the set of muscles and set of skills you have to descend a mountain and be a spender are different, and so part of it is just logistics, different set of equipment, different set of tools, and so in my industry that would be portfolios designed differently, money’s position differently, taxes are looked at differently but on top of that, you have to think differently and that’s a task that most struggle with.

[0:10:33] BB: Yeah, I saw a stat recently that was like 40% of Americans are at risk of going broke during their retirement years, and you mentioned something there that I wanted to hit on because when you’re planning, you have to think about not running out. So I was wondering, you mentioned this in the book but like, how do you approximate for that? I don’t know if that makes sense, are people just wishing that they’re going to live to a hundred and trying to save enough to get to a hundred, or how do you then go about that process of making sure you do have enough?

[0:11:04] Bradly Gotto: To go back to the mountain climbing analogy that you brought up earlier, the certain set of risks that that you face climbing a mountain can be very, very different than the ones descending, and so the obvious ones when you’re in the descent are, “How do I not run out of money?” Well, longevity is an issue, we don’t know how long you’re going to live. If I knew the day you’re going to die, we could reverse engineer this whole thing and it would be much more simple, but that’s something we need to plan for and plan around. Market volatility, when the markets go up and when they go down. We discuss this in the book in detail, it’s called sequence and returns risk. The bottom line is, and we’ve all felt this recently. The market’s at a pullback this year and if you’re retire right when the market’s pulling back and you take your first paycheck from your pile of money, you're taking that money out when it’s down and that’s a bad thing and that can exacerbate this problem, having to spend your money and force your money to run out much quicker. So sequencing is a problem. Inflation can be a problem, planning for when to take social security and what that’s going to look like can be a potential disaster, a pitfall. Congress is a big one because most of the money that people save for retirement is in a bucket that they’ve never been taxed on it yet. 401(k)s, IRAs, things like that and so congress has a lot of control over how much of your money you get to keep versus how much of it they get to take. So we have to be able to plan for those sorts of things and so, I can’t predict the future any more than anybody else and that’s not the point of the book is just to try to help you predict the future but, there are ways to plan for those unknowns and at least try to mitigate some of those risk because at the end of the day, the title of the book is purposeful because now that you want to be able to spend the money that you save because that’s the reason you saved it. But you want to have fun doing it and you don’t want it to be this stress ridden, anxiety ridden thing. Like when you’re descending the mountain, you want to enjoy it. Like look, I just summited. I made it. This was an amazing journey and I want to enjoy this trip down. I want every day to now be Saturday, that’s the attitude that you want to have but in order to do that, you have to plan appropriately. I mean, to kill off this mountain climbing analogy, you said, you’ve climbed a couple yourself. It's interesting that we’re recording this podcast today, I just read this really long article this morning. My wife was wondering why I wasn’t coming out of the bedroom this morning and I was like, “I got sucked into this article” on my iPhone about these four people that climbed Mount Denali in Alaska and one of the four fell a thousand feet on the descent and they were—

[0:13:26] BB: Oh goodness.

[0:13:28] Bradly Gotto: There’s this whole story. He ended up living, crazy enough, after falling a thousand feet but at the end of the day, the set of circumstance that caused that accident to happen. Where not circumstances that happened while you were climbing, they happen while you’re descending. So you just want to be able to enjoy it as much as you possibly can and have the correct tools in place and have the correct systems and process in place, so that you can have the safest journey you can possibly have on the way down.

[0:13:53] BB: So when we’re talking about actually having fun, I would imagine part of that is difficult. Maybe it’s more fun for you to get to do this but like, no two people are the same. When you’re thinking spending money and having fun, every one of our listeners is thinking something slightly different. I wonder, what are the main guardrails? Sounds funny because guardrails don’t sound fun but you have to have some sort of thing in place to make sure you don’t go crazy. So what are the foundations of a good mindset around money that also do allow us to have fun?

[0:14:24] Bradly Gotto: Yeah, you got to start with your values. Everybody values something different, right? And so, that’s where we start these conversations is, paint me the picture of what you want. Let’s start there because for all we know, maybe you can do everything you want. Maybe it fits within the parameters of what’s possible and what’s safe, relative to the amount of money that you have and any other paychecks you’ve got coming in the door or things like social security, but let’s at least start with what your every day is Saturday looks like. If we can’t quite accomplish it, that’s fine, but what I don’t want to do is put limitations or parameters on people before we even have any idea, and so some of those guardrails or some of those kind of thoughts for people are, you get the people that get to this phase of life and it’s a travelling phase for them. They have all these goals and dreams and the places they want to see before they die and all that kind of stuff and that’s awesome. For some people, their every day Saturday is literally built around their grandkids. So it’s not about going to Rome or going to Bali or places like that, it’s about, “I’ve got 17 grandkids and they live all over the country and I want to spend my life going to see those grandkids” and for other people, it’s, “I have these charities that I really love and I would love to be able to feel free to gift to these charities” or to this church or whatever it may be, “But I don’t know if I have enough money to do it.” So out of fear, they end up not doing it and so it could mean a lot of things is the bottom line, and so trying to define what your values are and what you want because at the end of the day, Benji, you can’t take it with you, right? You and I, obviously, I didn’t know this before the podcast, you and I have a similar background and whether you share the faith that I have or you don’t, one of the things that I’ve learned through my faith and through scripture is that, I just found this to be true in my job. Regardless if I’m working with other likeminded, faith-based people or not, is that there is this happy medium between being a saver and being prudent with the resources that you have versus hoarding, and for everybody to live that ‘every day is Saturday’ lifestyle, you want to be somewhere in between where you’re not just running around ad hoc with the resources that you have, but you’re also not living out of fear and anxiety and never spending any of it or do or giving any of it away or anything like that because you’re just worried about tomorrow. The happiest people live somewhere in between, and so for some of the families it means trying to loosen the purse strings a little bit and giving them the freedom to go spend some money and have some fun. Again, that could be on their lifestyle, it could be the charity, it could be a lot of things, and for other people it’s putting parameters around what it looks like to be a spender and to be prudent.

[0:17:02] BB: I like that, that’s a really good way of breaking it down and I just can imagine the switch you have to kind of flip in your mind of being a little difficult, getting used to that mindset being fun but just interesting and taking some time. You mentioned social security there briefly and I wanted to go there for a second, if someone is listening and they’re just going like, “No, I have a retirement income plan, I guess it’s my social security” but they haven’t thought beyond that, what’s the issue with that thinking?

[0:17:30] Bradly Gotto: Well, for most people it is not enough money to pick up the tab. It is a good supplement, it’s kind of a good—it is like having a second job or something like that or it’s a good side gig. It is really nice to have as a base or a core foundation in place for your retirement. The vast majority of the families that we talk to Benji though, it is not the end all be all, right? Or glad we have it. It is part of the plan and it is going to pick up some foundational level expenses for us but the rest of the onus is going to come on you to pick up the rest of your lifestyle. I mean, at the end of the day even the largest social security checks are three thousand, $3,500, $3,600 a month in that range, and a lot of people need more than that to live every single month, not everybody but a lot of people do and so we need to be diligent about planning around that. Now the good news is, it’s there but it also has its own tax implications and implications to how you should be saving the rest of your money, and so one of the mistakes that people make is they kind of silo these things. They’ve got social security over here kind of in silo A, pension over here in silo B, you know my IRA, 401(k) money over here in silo C and they think of them all differently, but at the end of the day, they all need to play well in the same sandbox together. Whether that’s from your overall investment strategy standpoint or that’s from a tax standpoint, because all these things hit your 1040 at the end of the year whether you want them to or not, and trying to be as efficient as we can each and every year relative to we call ITT in my office. You have ITT, you have investment, time and tax diversification, structuring your life from a tax perspective and tax diversification, investment diversification and then also time. You know, when you’re my age Benji, I am 40 and you’re saving, you just kind of put it away and you just let it do what it does and let the markets do what they do, and they don’t think about it. It is the right thing to do but when you get to retirement, you need to start silo-ing it out from a time perspective and this is the money I plan on dipping into and using maybe years three through 10, and then having another bucket where I don’t need all my money right now. Some of it I don’t need for 10 years, I need to be cognizant of that as well, and I need you to be invested and thought about very differently no matter—depending on where you have the money structure from a time perspective, a tax and an investment perspective and social security. It just kind of wraps into all of that.

[0:19:43] BB: I wanted to touch on one of the other chapters that, I admit, just hadn’t done a ton of thinking around, that I thought was really insightful and that was just the widow, widower conversation. Because a lot does change when there is a loss in that and it creates all sorts of different situations. So walk me through some of what people need to think even there, when there is a loss of a loved one and the financial differences, even the amount of money coming in and how you can plan for that.

[0:20:17] Bradly Gotto: Yeah, the two hardest phases of retirement are the actual retirement itself and the fears and anxieties that go along with walking out of your job and the onus laying on you and once you kind of get past that and get into this new rhythm of life, the next hardest thing to deal with is losing your spouse and it is, I am not downplaying the emotional piece of it because that is definitely the hardest part is losing your loved one. But there are also financial ramifications and impacts to that, not just the fact that you lost one social security payment. As an example, for your married couple, you both have a social security check coming in the door, one of those social security checks just disappeared. If you have pensions, it’s possible that you have a single life pension so maybe we lost a pension payment but also and this is the point that most people tend to miss. The widow or widower is not married anymore and because they are not married, they do not file taxes as a married person. They file taxes as a single person and so if they were living on, let’s just use an easy round number, if they were living on $10,000 a month prior to the death of their spouse and they want to maintain that, that doesn’t hit the tax code at all in the same way and we see massive increases in the tax rates for widows and widowers. So you get the same amount of income coming in the door but you actually get to keep less of it because the IRS is now keeping more of it, and so I could extrapolate on that and go to the bigger conversation, but the bottom line is there is planning that should be done around that thought before, hopefully, you lose your spouse, because Benji, at the end of the day I mean if you’re married, what are the odds that you and your spouse die on the same day? Not great, so it just means that this is going to happen to almost everybody. So there’s some obvious things that need to be planned for. You know, none of us are going to beat death and so planning for that, an end of life, makes a ton of sense. Nobody pushes back when we go, “Okay, you know Mr. and Mrs. Client, we need to set an end date and a proposed end date for your plan of your longevity. How long do you think you’re going to live?” You know, it is a shot in the dark but we know eventually it is going to happen, nobody argues with the fact that’s going to happen. This idea of you becoming a widow or widower, if you’re married it’s not a 100% because it is possible you die on the same day, but it is about 99.9% that that’s not going to happen that way and so it is just one of those areas where understanding the ramifications of that, whether it’s from your cashflow perspective from an IRS or tax perspective or from an investment perspective, it is just very important.

[0:22:56] BB: I want to come up for air in this conversation by going, one of the issues that I see even when I mentioned that stat earlier on 40% of Americans being at risk of going broke during their retirement, part of that is just a lack of true financial literacy and money feeling complicated, people not knowing where to start having all sorts of different thoughts and beliefs around finances that are hard to overcome, and we carry that our whole lives without really going much beyond. You know, you could start talking about certain and even parts of your book where my eyes glaze over because I’m like, “Oh these concepts seem so hard” and I have to consciously bring myself back into it. So we need people like you to help us through this process but I wonder, for those that aren’t quite at the age where they’re like constantly thinking about retirement, where would you tell people to start? Where should people start learning better financial literacy, better financial planning? Give us some like tools, resources, thoughts there as we start to wrap up today?

[0:23:58] Bradly Gotto: It’s a great question and of course I’m bias to my industry because I do believe that my industry can provide value, but I’ll just use an analogy. At the end of the day if, Benji, I don’t know if you golf or don’t golf. I attempt to, I’ll put it that way.

[0:24:16] BB: I attempt to, too. I think we’re in the same bucket there.

[0:24:19] Bradly Gotto: All right, so we’re both paying greens fees is basically what you’re saying. I always define golf by if you’re good, you don’t pay greens fees. If you are not good, you pay greens fees. You may be less bad than me but it doesn’t mean you’re good. Golf is one of those deals where if you want to learn how to golf on your own, you absolutely can do it and there is all kinds of videos you can watch on YouTube. There is books you can read, there is all these things that you can do to become a better golfer and you can kind of DIY you way through it, right? The other way to do it is to get a coach and have a coach look at you from the outside, giving objective opinion, watch what you’re doing, give you instant feedback and kind of go through that process with you. Now, you could make the argument there isn’t a right or wrong answer to that. If you want to DIY that on your own versus go and hire a coach to do it for you but it stands to reason that all the best golfers in the world have a coach. Tiger Woods has a coach still to this day, right? The number one golfer in the world today still has a coach and so getting somebody to give you an objective opinion is really, really important and just having outside council speak into your life, like anything else. Whether you are trying to get in shape and you want a personal trainer, obviously your odds of success when you train with a personal trainer than you trying to do it on your own and maybe that just means you have a group of friends that you’re accountable to with your health, whether it is working out or your diet or whatever it may be but at the end of the day, living life on your own in my opinion Benji is just not how we are built. I just don’t think the human again, regardless of your religious beliefs and how you think we were ever made, I don’t think you can make the argument that the average human being was built to be in isolation. I think that our best successes in life whether it’s financial or otherwise come when we live life in a meaningful way with others, and so whether you have to go to a financial adviser to find that expertise and that coach and that partner and whatever it may be, or maybe you’ve got a group at your church that you go that meets and keeps each other accountable to their finances. I think the biggest mistake you can make as a young person is keeping your finances to yourself and keeping them private. I think in America, we have just privatized money to the extent where the average person would rather talk to you about anything, their sex life frankly, than they would their money. It is just such a private thing, I just think it’s a mistake. I just think that we should be living life together in meaningful ways in areas that can have a large impact and money more than most has an impact in our lives. So finding those resources, those people you can partner with, somebody you can trust to speak into your life, obviously you want them to have the expertise and so if you don’t have that in your friend group or whatever, you probably need to find somebody like a firm like ours that can partner with you in that way but better to do something than nothing and Benji, I will end that, this is probably a longer answer than you wanted but I got two boys at home. They are 12 and nine right now and I have already started talking to them about this sort of stuff and so even at their ages Benji, when they have money come to the door, that money could be through like my 12 year old is starting to kind of get jobs. He is umpiring baseball games in the summer and he is working at church on Sundays now with the little kids and things like that and he is starting to get paychecks or if it’s through Christmas or birthdays or however they come into money. The rule in our house is that 50% of that money, they get to do whatever they want with. That’s theirs, 25% of it they have to save and whatever they save, I match and so I am kind of building in this idea even at 12 and nine years old that when you save money, kind of like a 401(k), you are going to get benefits for that, and then 25% of it they have to give away to charities, non-profits, whatever they see fit and try to build in this idea of generosity for them. But the bottom line is, I am trying to teach them good values right away the second that they have money coming in the door, and also teaching the value of time because at 12 and nine years old, the money that they save today has more time to work for them than any other dollar that they’ll ever save, and so the example I like to give is if you save money from 25 to 36, so if you are listening to this podcast, you are not the 50, 55 year old client that would pick up the book. But you’re in your savings years, from 25 to 36 Benji, if you saved whatever amount, five grand a year for retirement or whatever and then stopped and never saved another dime from 25 to 36, or you started doing it at 36 and did it from 36 all the way to 65. So instead of those first 11 years, you did it for the next 30 years, you will have more money assuming the same rate of return, if you have done it from 25 to 36 than if you would have done it from 36 all the way to 65 because of the way time and compounding works. Even bringing things linearly, it is hard to understand compound interest but you need to use it in your favor, and so saving even a little bit, people get so stuck on this idea that I can’t save a lot, so it’s any more worth doing, it’s not true. You absolutely need to start yesterday, pay yourself first. If you have never heard that before, before you start to pay other people and just make sure you’ve got that savings started, build that habit in your life and build a good strong foundation.

[0:29:14] BB: Yeah, if there is two takeaways from this conversation, I would say one is make sure you’re in some sort of community where you can talk about money freely or get an adviser, someone that’s on your side, on your team clearly around this topic. Then the second one would be go to YouTube, go learn about compound interest and apply it, yes, to your knowledge and understanding of money. But then think about it with your time, talent and treasure because when you think about it, how compounding interest works as if you are younger listening to this, it literally does apply to everything, and the more that you learn and lean in, in your early years it will pay off overtime significantly, not just when it comes to money. So I think that was a fantastic way to conclude this thing. Brad, tell me a little bit about the firm, tell me a bit about where people can stay connected with the work you’re doing and how people could reach out.

[0:30:07] Bradly Gotto: Yeah, so Fiat Wealth Management is the name of the firm. If you are like, “Gosh, that’s kind of an interesting name” you can learn all about why that’s the name of the firm on our website and everything else you want to know. We are high on education, so whether it’s the book, we have our own podcast called Every Day is Saturday. You can check out our podcast, we write blogs all the time. We do an inner circle workshop every month, which is over Zoom. It is free to attend, it is an educational workshop, topic rotation. So the topics are different every single month but all of that information and all of the different ways that we provide education, not just to the families that we serve but to our community and the people that just find us, frankly, is on our website and that’s Fiat WM, since we’re wealth management, fiatwm.com. So, that is the easiest way to kind of get in touch with us, learn about our firm, what we’re all about but the bottom line is, we’re high in education. I just want to—when I define success Benji because it is always good to look forward and work back, right? If I—when I get to retirement and I look over my career and I’m like, “Gosh, I did Fiat” you know, scratch the itch for me, “Were my values guiding the decisions?” “Am I going to be happy with my career with what Fiat did?” and these sorts of things and what defines that, the number one thing for me is making a meaningful impact in people’s lives. Removing stress, removing anxiety, removing doubt, these sorts of things is the thing that keeps me going, it is the thing that keeps me rocking and the things that makes me write a book, which is a daunting task and not something that I ever thought I would ever do. So yeah, that’s a little bit about the firm and kind of what we’re going on here. We are based in the Twin Cities in Minneapolis and St. Paul, but we work with clients from Alaska to Florida and everywhere in between.

[0:31:45] BB: Well again, the book is titled, Spending Money and Having Fun: Your Practical Guide to a Fearless Retirement. Brad, this has been a great conversation, thanks for stopping by Author Hour. It’s been a pleasure.

[0:31:57] Bradly Gotto: Yeah, thanks Benji. I appreciated it.

[0:32:00] BB: Thanks for joining us for this episode of Author Hour. You can find, Spending Money and Having Fun: Your Practical Guide to a Fearless Retirement, on Amazon. A transcript of this episode and all of our previous episodes is available at authorhour.co. For more Author Hour, follow the podcast on your favorite podcast platform. Thanks for joining us, we’ll see you next time. Same place, different author.